S5E3: Fat Dish: Swan Boats, Fat Folks, and Self-Loving your Way out of Anti-Fat Bias
S5E3: Fat Dish:
Swan Boats, Fat Folks, and Self-Loving your Way out of Anti-Fat Bias
Released on August 3rd, 2022. For complete episode info, visit this page!
SB: Cheesy–
CP: –Bum bum bum, bah bah, bum bum bum. What is that?
SB: (Laughs) What is that?!
CP: (Singing) If you leave me now, you, what is that song? (Both singing random snippets) I want you to stay, oooo–I think an 80’s sitcom, is that Supertramp? That's 80s. That's what must have got me on that train.
SB: I'm stopping this madness.
CP: Please do so.
[THEME MUSIC FADES IN, FADES OUT]
CP: Welcome to Matter of Fat, a body-positive podcast with Midwest sensibilities. Hi, I'm Cat Polivoda; a local fat feminist and shop owner who has some real summertime vibes going on. And I promise it is just, it is not exclusive to my very sweaty glow, though that's part of it as well. (Saraya laughs) I am joined by my cohost and producer, Saraya Boghani.
SB: Hi, I'm Saraya. I'm a fat, multiracial, Minneapolitan millennial who absolutely adores unstructured time. Give me free weekends, give free weeknights. I'd like to basically be a cell phone plan in the early 2000s. (Cat laughs) Bring back ringback tones! Hashtag bring back ringback tones, make it happen.
CP: Wow. Uh, so on Matter of Fat, in addition to ringtones from the early 2000s, we're here to talk about the cultural politics of fat liberation with a Midwest perspective.
SB: Yes. And we're back with another Fat Dish episode.
CP: That's right. Our Fat Dish episodes are usually interspersed between our interview episodes, and are full of us dishing; chatting about the pod; our lives; often what we've been watching or reading or listening to; and of course, diving into fat topics and issues that we wanna discuss.
SB: And we have a lot to talk about in this one.
CP: I can't wait to get into it. Uh, so we gotta, let's go!
[TRANSITION MUSIC FADES IN, FADES OUT]
SB: Okay, let's go. Let's get into it. Let's start with the Matter of Fat Dish. Our first interview episode came out!
CP: Oh, it was so nice to get back into the interview groove.
SB: It was–I felt rusty. I don't know about you, but I definitely felt rusty.
CP: I did as well. I think it was a great interview, and also it was like, “Oh, we're back to this.” It had been a while since we recorded an interview.
SB: Summer was a dream to talk to, I honestly could have talked with her for so much longer.
CP: And I will–and also we're in this weird in-between time where, when you listen to this episode, Summer and I will have talked at Magers & Quinn, but as we record this, we have not talked yet. So Saraya, asked me if I wanted to pretend, (Saraya laughs) or like, if we wanted to record a few different scenarios to interspersed once we had done the event. I instead said that I would prefer to pull back the curtain and let you know that we have not actually done that yet.
SB: It's gonna be great. I’m very excited.
CP: I'm really looking forward to it. And I've, um, been emailing a bit with Summer and the person–I don't, I don't actually don't really know their role–but someone who's been involved in the book tour. And they said that it's an event you have to register for–and of course, you know that Saraya, ‘cuz you've registered for it–but I think it's like, there's like already like 60 people or something, and I think that that's pretty close to the capacity, ‘cuz it's just a small little bookstore.
SB: That's a lot of, I mean, that's about the same or more as like Roxane Gay, if I remember.
CP: I think it does feel like that. And I, I wonder if it'll be a similar setup as that talk. Gosh, that was so many years ago. So I get to see you in real life, Saraya, on Monday, huh?
SB: Yeah. It's all happening or happened or, depending on, depending upon when you listen to this.
CP: This is a little time-space continuum. I don't know how I feel about this.
SB: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. You're not into it. You’re not into multiverse. No, we should talk about how we did see each other in real life. Is that what you were setting up?
CP: I was, I was, you were picking up what I was putting down! Ay!
SB: And you were putting down a really delicious dish, tortilla espanola. (Both laugh)
CP: Saraya, you are the queen of a segue. I'm just like, “Uh, next.” And you're like, “So blah, blah–” my God. And I was really
SB: –It was not good as you think it was. (Cat laughs) But I will say the reason I talked about it is because Cat came over to my house and I made breakfast! We had a little brunch moment.
CP: That was so nice.
SB: Yeah. It was really lovely, and made tortilla espanola. That's why, that's why. It had a little bit of a Midwest twist on it. For purists, you will not enjoy this, but instead of using just like potatoes, I used tater tots.
CP: It was delightful.
SB: I thought it was great. And then there was this like, like mixed green salad on top with like, a really lovely vinagrette. Oh, it was just so it was so good.
CP: Saraya, I love eating anything in any meal at your house, you are such a good host and such a good cook.
SB: Thank you.
And I just love it. I also love spending time with Bogie, and also end up getting just like fully saturated with dog kisses.
SB: Ew. I don't think you wanna–you basically went to the spot and my dog gave you a lovely cleansing facial, I guess, which like, I could never, I do not do dog kisses. It's not for me. But you really let him lick to his heart’s content.
CP: Yeah. I regret to inform you that that is like, high on the list of like, my own personal white lady nonsense (Saraya laughs) that I will allow an animal to lick my face, um, a lot actually. And I own it. It is nonsense and I'm not proud of it, but here I am talking about it on the pod. But I love my nephew Bogart.
SB: I was gonna say, he absolutely adores you and it, yeah. So cute. You're taking one for the team. So we had a nice little moment, and I mean, I feel like other than that, it's been kind of quiet. I'm wondering, do you have any updates, uh, regarding the podcast? Some scuttlebutt?
CP: (Gasps) Saraya, you said the word, not me. Ayyy.
SB: I know, and I hate it so much.
CP: Oh, I love it so much. Oh my gosh. This is truly–it is season five in which, and like the year 2022, in which our roles are reversing in many ways.
SB: Tables turning constantly. Wait, do you remember the fun fact about scuttlebutt? The origin?
CP: Oh my God. ‘Cuz you looked it up, ‘cuz I incorrectly was influenced and I–or I had, my default was to spell it with D’s. It is, in fact, T’s. And we looked up where the word started, and I actually forgot it, but of course Saraya, you remember. What is it?
SB: I looked it, I looked it up. So apparently on ships, back in the day, they had the cask for holding the clean water, and so they called that the scuttlebutt. And then my head it’s like, “Oh, the water cooler,” like the water cooler’s going. Gonna go share some scuttlebutt, share some water, hot goss, get into that. So there you go. Anyways, what a detour, what a detour.
CP: It is a welcome detour, as is every Fat Dish episode. All of the ways we weave around.
I agreed that like, nothing major has happened recently, which has kind of been nice. I think we've just like really easily moved into our season five routine. But I was thinking like, you know, there were some cool things that had happened like, between seasons that I don't know if we ever really talked about on the podcast.
Like one of them was: at some point in maybe the fall or winter, we were looking on our website to see where traffic is from. The internet is so cool; do you know that you can like, look behind the–I mean, everyone probably knows–if you have a website, you can look behind the scenes and see like, where, what places are directing traffic to you? And through that, we saw that we were listed in a syllabus or in a discussion post, or some kind of college literature, curriculum thing.
We couldn't click through to see what it was for, but that–I guess it's such a little thing, but we were really delighted by that when we found that out earlier in the year.
SB: It's just always so interesting to be quoted or highlighted for the work we've done. I'm not, I shouldn't be surprised, but also I am, and also grateful that people wanna discuss it and dive into it more. So that's cool.
CP: There was also a time earlier in the year or, or the end of last year, sometime, you know, between season four and five where we were approached about a company using an episode or two of ours in like their–was it like, a fat liberation week or like a fat awareness week? That they were having as like, a coworker education kind of thing. Am I remembering that right? Saraya?
SB: Yeah, you are. So this, they had their like DEI program managers–I don't know what their exact titles were–but they reached out to us and they said, “We're doing this fat lib week.” And it was really cool because some of it was asynchronous learning, so people who work for the organization could just like, tune in to an episode of ours or do some other content that they had built out to highlight other fat creators. And then I think they had a live session or two as well. It's really well done.
CP: It was really cool. And what was kind of like, weird and wonderful was that they didn't need anything from us, you know? They're just like, “Yeah, we're gonna use these episodes you already created,” like, “May we share these?” And that was really cool, to know that like, the work we've put into this can have educational or enjoyment effects, like beyond us in this room.
I don't know. It just felt like, it felt very cool to me.
SB: Yeah. And I will say, they did it right as well. Like, they compensated us. They didn’t have to do that. It wasn't a LOT a lot, but anything is–
CP: –Anything’s helpful.
SB: Yeah. So appreciated. And so I was really impressed with, you know, you doing this programming, you could have easily have just taken it, it's free for anyone. But then to be compensated and acknowledged for the work we did was really cool. So I'm glad you, you suggested we bring this up and talk about a little bit.
CP: Yeah. That was just like, some cool stuff that had come to light between last season, till now. Any other Matter of Fat scuttlebutt?
SB: Stop. Let's not.
CP: Matter of fat dish? Are you ready, Saraya, to get into some personal dish?
SB: Personal dish? Yes. Let's get into it.
CP: You go for it. What's been going on with you?
SB: Okay. Um, I'll start with pool time, baby. I've been in the pool.
CP: Oh yeah, you Swimply’d!
SB: Yeah. I did a Swimply moment with friend of the podcast, Mam. Um, not like our moms. I mean, I'd be down for a mom pool party sometimes.
CP: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. My mom would, my mom loves the pool. Love the floating moment. Oh yeah.
SB: Oh yes. Yes. It was the perfect like, snatch of summer afternoon time. It was just in the afternoon on a Thursday. I had an appointment later, so I had some time off and just drove over to Minnetonka, hopped in some random person's backyard, and hung out with Mam for a little bit. And it was just the perfect day.
But then I also went, so I–this kind of randomly came up where my friend's family was at like a KOA camp in Hayward, Wisconsin.
CP: Hayward! Okay!
SB: Yeah, out to Wisco! And she was like, “Hey–” actually she's friend of the pod, Rachel–
CP: –I was like, what friend? Do I know them? Yes I do!
SB: Of course you do. Of course, you know everybody.
Um, and she was like, “Hey, you wanna go out for like a little day trip?” And so we went out there and it was really nice. They had like these small cabins that were very well-kept or like brand new, even. Had a fire, we got to eat some good Midwestern camping snacks and foods, and then got to hang out by the pool. So it was a really nice time.
CP: That sounds awesome.
SB: Yeah. Do you know a lot about Hayward? Do you have any fun Hayward facts?
CP: I don't have a lot of fun Hayward facts, but one of my high school besties, her family has a cabin in Hayward. My family never had a cabin. We were not cabin people. We didn't have the means to be cabin people, but Chrissy did, and I got to go to her cabin a lot when I was in high school, and that was just like the absolute most fun.
God, I love her. I love her family. Her parents actually have retired there, and so they like–every day at 4 o'clock, take a pontoon ride around the lake, and it's just like the sweetest life. So I have really fond feelings of Hayward because of Chrissy and her fam.
SB: Yeah. You know who else had a cabin there?
CP: Who?
SB: Al Capone.
CP: (Laughs) And that's your connection to Hayward? Cool. Cool, cool, cool.
SB: No, it was just–while I was there, I found out that he had this cabin in the middle of nowhere in Hayward, and that's where he was apprehended and caught.
CP: Seriously?
SB: Yeah.
CP: When were you reading Hayward fun facts, Saraya?
SB: I wasn't–Rachel laid it out for me, ‘cause she and her family had been going there for like 20+ years.
CP: Got it. Okay.
SB: So she grew up going out there with her little brother and friends.
CP: Oh, sweet. Cool, cool cool.
SB: So there's a fun fact for you.
CP: That's awesome.
SB: Yeah. Do you have any water-related personal dishes that you'd like to get into?
CP: Oh my God, gan I give you very cutting-edge, personal dish related to water?
SB: Please.
CP: Oh my God. This is so fun. Okay. This had happened this morning, so it's really cutting, cutting edge. So as you know, Saraya,--and as you also probably know podcast listeners, I love water aerobics, and Neno–my boo–and I joined the Y a couple months ago, and we've been doing water aerobics a couple mornings a week.
Well, Neno, like–so I grew up swimming, I grew up across the street from a city pool. I took all the swim lessons. I'm very comfortable in the water. Neno didn't grow up swimming, and so they're like, getting used to the water and kind of learning how to swim. Actually, I think they might do adult swim lessons in the fall, which would be the cutest thing ever.
SB: Cute. That's great!
CP: So they are like, they've been getting like some goggles and some nose plugs and just little, like, you know; things that you get to try out swimming and going underwater and that kind of thing.
Well, today after water aerobics, we reserved lanes for lap swimming, but they wanted to try out their goggles. And then they like, dropped something at the bottom of the pool and I was like, “Oh, I'll I can get that for you,” ‘cuz they had two pair of goggles. And actually–they won't listen, I don't think, they don't listen to the pod. I don't know if they'll ever hear me tell you all this.
But they, so they'll be–we're validating them, but they don't need to know. They got two pair of goggles and I was like, “What'd you get two pair for?”
And they were like, “You're gonna want one of these at some point.” And I was like, “No I won't.” But then today I like, put the goggles on so I could go retrieve the thing at the bottom of the pool, and I brought it up and I was like, “Oh yeah, that's fun.” ‘Cuz usually I don't get my head in the water, but I was like, “Well, once it's in, let me just like do more flopping around here.”
And then I was kind of helping them learn how to like, go underwater. And like, when you're in the deep end, like, push yourself down so you can touch the bottom, you know? And the way they responded–it's just like a kid, you know what I mean? ‘Cuz like, they didn't do that as a young person. Like, you remember when you were young and you like, splashed around the pool and learned how to do new things and stuff?
SB: Handstands on the bottom of the pool? Absolutely.
CP: Oh my God, yeah! Oh, it's so cool. And so like to see the, like, childlike wonder in them as they–oh my God. It is just like the sweetest thing ever. And then it was also fun for me to be like, “Actually, thank you so much for getting that extra pair of goggles. I loved going under too. That was very fun.” You know, it was, uh, a good morning.
So that is some cutting edge water scuttlebutt in Cat's world. But other than that, just the regular beach time, water aerobics, that kind of thing.
SB: Any other aquatic endeavors that you care to share about?
CP: (Gasps) The swans. Is that what you wanna talk about?
SB: Is that what you wanna talk about?
CP: I mean, I think I have to, ‘cuz it relates to a personal update, but also I think, well–this will, we'll have a little, we'll call back to this when we talk about some fat stuff.
SB: Okay. Sounds good.
CP: So recently, Neno and I had our six month anniversary of dating, and we had talked abou–actually they brought up doing–so like on Lake Como and Lake Nokomis and maybe some other lakes, they have paddleboats that are shaped like swans, and they just like, look so fun and silly.
And so they had suggested we do that for our anniversary and we're like, “Oh yeah, it sounds really fun.” And actually, my coworker Mawrgyn told me that at Lake Como, they are lit up and you can go at night. And I was just like, “Oh my God, how really pretty freaking romantic. That sounds like the best thing ever.”
This past weekend was our anniversary, and we went on Friday and we were like, the timing was wrong. They were all taken. So we're like, “Okay, well, come back on Saturday,” it was raining, so we went back on Sunday. So we go back on Sunday and we get in. We're like, “Okay, cool. We get to make it work this time.” But we were too heavy for the paddleboats. And I, I don't usually encounter, like, fat–I don't know. Like as a fat person, I navigate through a world that is not set up for me all the time, but I've been so privileged to really make it work.
I think part of that is that I don't carry a lot of weight like in my hips, you know? So I, even if it's uncomfortable, I can usually–I can often shimmy into things, and, do you know what I mean? Even if it's not like, pleasant, it's usually not like, “No, you can't do this,” for me. So it was just frustrating that we couldn't do this thing.
I have this impression that like, if we were to have been lifted up and plopped in the middle of the paddle boat, we probably would've been okay. But like, you have to like, get into it; and so when you do like the step, it just took on too much water for it to be safe for us to be in there. Also like, my shoes got all wet and I was mad at it.
But I also, like, I'm a fat person who does her research, you know? And I learned on their website, they said that they had two people boats and five people boats. The two person boats, they just said accommodate two people. And the 15–or, excuse me–the five people boats, they said fit up to 1500 pounds. So in my mind, I was like, “Okay, cool. If, for some reason we don't fit in the two person boat. We could just see if we could do the bigger boat,” you know?
SB: Yeah.
CP: But they didn't have those at that location, but they didn't say that in any of their literature or anything. So, it was a really big bummer and like, I was–I'm me. So I went into like, Cat-will-take-care-of-it mode. I was like, “Okay, here's your life jacket back. Here's this, I'm gonna get a refund. Thank you for your refund. Bye!” Blah blah, you know, all of that stuff.
And you know, it's just like teenagers who run these things and so it wasn't like–the kid who was helping us wasn't–wasn't like, rude or unkind, but just not very helpful. And I had to be like, we actually tried two boats and I had to be the one to ask like, “Are we just too heavy for this?”
And for him to be like, (deep teenager voice) “Yeah, I, I guess like, you can go get a refund,” you know. I'm like, “Okay dude, thank you.” It was just kind of demoralizing.
And like I said, I feel I'm like–I'm bummed about it, but I'm fine with it. Neno was really sad about it, and that was hard. That was sad for me to see them so sad, you know? So yeah, it was just a big bummer, and just a reminder that stuff isn't built for us fat folks, especially when you're in a very, like a large, heavy, fat power couple like I am. (Laughs)
SB: With great power comes with great responsibility, Cat.
CP: Yeah, yeah. And too much, too much weight for that swan boat. That's for sure.
CP: Yeah. So that’s a bummer.
SB: Is it to the point where like, you don't even wanna try the other location?
CP: Neno doesn't want to. I would contemplate, and maybe someday we'll get there, but it was just sort of like, this ship has sailed, especially ‘cuz like, we had already went back one time. Actually, both my friend Margo and my coworker Mawrgyn joked in a loving way, that swan has sailed.
SB: Yes, yes.
CP: That swan has sailed.
Yeah, yeah. So–and actually, what was sad is that like, when we were making our notes for this, I like, wrote that I wanted to talk about this ‘cuz I was so excited about it. And then my update about it actually today when we're recording is like, not a fun update and it's a bummer.
SB: But I appreciate you telling it because it is accurate to the experience!
CP: Yeah, it is. And then I did like, the normal thing; like I had actually, in addition to going on the website, I had like asked in our Twin Cities Fat Community Facebook about it. People said, “Oh, look at the weight limit for these other ones is 1500. You should be fine.” And so then I edited that and like, let people know.
I also made a review on their thing to just say like, “Hey, this was my experience as a fat person. Also, like, you don't have this information on your website, y'all; like, I would've, I could have avoided this had you had some information on the website or in real life that shared this,” you know?
So they just need to do better about, if there are limitations for what's possible, they just need to share that, you know?
SB: Yeah.
CP: Yeah.
SB: So I have a tangent tell that is like, slightly related. I haven't really thought it out, so go on this journey with me.
CP: Yes.
SB: Okay. So I think I'm wondering too, if it's particularly disappointing, you already did all this research. You're also a person who has surrounded themselves with very, like, liberation, like, focused people. And so I too have done that in some ways, not as much as you, but I realized the other day–I had a moment where I was like, “Oh, yeah. People don't understand when I say fat, it's not a bad thing.” I was having a delightful conversation with like an acquaintance-slash-I would call them a friend right now. But at one point I referred to myself as fat and it was fine. There's no reaction, whatever. And then at the end they were like, “I just want you to know, I heard what you said about being fat and you are beautiful–”
CP: –Oof, OOF–
SB: –And they were so sincere and so kind, they were just being so kind.
And I was like, “Yeah, (laughs) yep. I get it.” It's like, I'm not, I'm not using that in the commonplace terminology. And it's so wild to me, ‘cuz like, when we started this podcast, I was not calling myself fat until then. Yet in this transition time, I did it so, just, nonchalantly.
I was surprised when somebody else who was part of society and understands the larger use of that word was like, being very kind and very sincere. And I was like, “Oh yeah, not everybody knows this and I am in a luxury space where most of the people around me either support my use of it and don't question it, or know, um, what I mean by that.”
Which is–which I would imagine if we're gonna go back to the beginning, you know, when you have that comfort, even when you're trying to accommodate that in the greater world, it hurts a lot, then, when something like that with the swans pops up.
CP: Or it's just like more jarring. Because yeah, it’s so–I think that it is a very common, fat experience that's unfortunately very like, matter of fact, very mundane, very much something fat people deal with all day every day. Is that what she did there? But yeah, for me, I just am so fortunate to have a life that is just like, it's not as if every
SB: Saw what you did there.
CP: (Laughs), Oh, thank you. (Both laugh) But yeah for me, I just am so fortunate to have a life that is like–where I go has universal design, you know; but it's just like, I don't encounter stuff like this super often.
And then it also makes me just think more like about how, part of the reason I maybe don't encounter stuff like this is ‘cuz I just do my regular routine and I don't do like a lot of active–like I don't like, I don't care that I probably can't bungee jump, ‘cuz I don't want to bungee jump, you know? Things like that.
Like there are just things that are not available to me, but typically I don't have interest in doing those things anyway. So it just feels really jarring to be like, “Oh, this was just like a regular old thing that I thought would be really cute and romantic, but like, oh, not a possibility,” you know?
SB: Yeah, yeah. For sure. I suppose, too, dating; like, you're entertaining more of those couple activities than before. So that comes up as well.
CP: Yeah. And I do think too, it is–I mean, like, just to be frank, it's because we're two fat people, you know? Like if I was, if, if either of us were coupled up with somebody who wasn't as big, like maybe that wouldn't have been something we experienced, you know? So like, the realities of that–
SB: –Or, that individual would have to deal with feeling–
CP: –By themself. I mean, I wouldn't have it any other way. Um, I think life is just like, so much better the more fat people I have in it, including a fat partner. But yeah, it's just–yeah, it's just a lot. And maybe I'm still processing, I don't know. But yeah, that was my, that was a little fat moment that came up.
SB: Well I, I want to plug a fat moment that I had.
CP: Yes!
SB: At the Coven, coworking space, with Amy Siegel, previous guest of the pod.
CP: Yes! What was that, season two? Season two? Season two.
SB: Yeah, I think so, mhmm.
So with my new job, I have more capacity to do projects and meetings. So I reached out to Amy, who is the manager at the St. Paul location of The Coven, which is a co-working space that is just phenomenal. I've always seen it from afar and wanted to experience it, and she was so kind to set me up with, you know, a day of working there, and I love having fat folks in positions to like, create comfortable environments. ‘Cuz she was like, “Hey, I set you up here. It's really great. If you don't like these chairs, there's those other ones over there. Um, you can trade things out.” She was just so mindful of accommodations, not only for my size, but I think about accessibility. She gave me so many different options, too.
And so I was just really, really pleased with that experience in a way that like, you don't always get. It was very intentional. So shout out, not getting paid for this at all, but shout out to The Coven and Amy for creating a wonderful moment there. Also it's just like, very aesthetically pleasing in there.
CP: Yeah, it’s real cute. I have not been to that location because I think it came up in the pandemic or right before maybe? But yeah, all the pictures are good. They're just, they do really good with decorating and color and stuff, which is awesome.
SB: Yeah, it was fun. It was good time.
CP: Cool. Oh, and Amy's so, so great.
SB: She is, she is. It also like got me thinking. So I was there for a day and then like over lunch, I went to the WA Frost patio and just like a bougie moment. Ganted, like–listen. I got this sourdough, like, appetizer or whatever, and a cup soup; and they gave me like five pieces of sourdough bread and like an infused olive oil. You would've loved it, Cat.
But I was like, “Heck yeah.” I’m eating all these pieces of bread. And I felt like I should be Oprah, just shouting, “I love bread!” (Both laugh) Five giant pieces of sourdough. They were delightful. But I will say, being in that area and like having my little fancy lunch and going to the beautiful Coven, it's like, oh, I should live in, I should live in Cathedral Hill in St. Paul. I should do that. Because I am moving and I'm actively apartment searching right now. And the thing is, I feel like I'm an HGTV, you know, customer. And I am not, I don't know why I think I have so many choices, ‘cuz it is a rude awakening; every time I'm like going to go to a showing, they're like, “Oh, sorry, I already signed it, already signed it, already signed it.”
I'm like, “Just let me look at it. Just lemme look at it! C’mon!
CP: That's hard. When you, with the idea of having an HGTV, like, desires with a budget that's not quite there. That's how I feel. And like I had this, like this realization a couple years ago, like, “God, I'm not loving how my place is decorated.” And I realized like, “Oh, it's because I have an elevated sense of style that I cannot afford.” Like, it is a sense of style that I admire and aspire to that I just like, am not there yet. And so (laughs) that's, yeah. That's how I feel, like HGTV has been both an inspiration and done me wrong.
SB: Yeah! Also, let's talk about TikTok and all the DIYers who are like, “Oh, easy, build this like bookcase.” And it's like, I think I can do these things. I will not be able to do those things.
CP: And it's possible, there's just a lot of investment that goes into that in supplies, but also just like, time and ability too. Like, are there, like, how easy is it for me to find a ladder that I feel comfortable crawling all the way up there to install this thing, you know? There's just, like, the thoughts around that kind of thing too.
SB: For sure, for sure.
CP: St. Paul is where it’s at, Saraya!
SB: Listen, people are trying to convert me. I do. I'm gonna go check on another place this weekend in St Paul. So your girl may not be a Minneapolitan millennial for much longer! We shall see.
CP: Well, actually, you know what? The podcast is ending, times are changing. Transitions are near. I mean, it sounds–it could, that could happen.
SB: Wow. Wow wow wow.
CP: I have said many times that I cannot wait to move back to St. Paul. I've said that every day that I've lived in Minneapolis for the last five years, every day.
SB: What do you do, (Cat laughs) you wake up in the morning and look in the mirror, “One day, St. Paul!”
CP: “St. Paul will be mine!” I don't mean–just like, there's never been a moment where I've not wanted to move back to St. Paul. (Laughs)
SB: What part of St. Paul?
CP: I would be happy in a lot of parts of St. Paul. I, so I lived in the Midway when we went to Hamline. I like the Midway area; Neno lives in the Midway area, I like it over there. I like the West Seventh area. I also lived over that way. I like West St. Paul a lot. There's some cute little houses over there, but real–and honestly, there are, it is hard for me to think of an area of St. Paul where I would not be open to moving. I am just, I like St. Paul.
SB: All right. You heard it here, folks. And not for the first, you’ve heard it before–
CP: I mean, you've heard it before. You've heard it for five years. (Both laugh)
SB: Every day. Every single day.
CP: That was maybe a little dramatic–
SB: –Not all the time, but, what is the TikTok thing?
CP: “Not all the time every day, but every day.” Basically. Though I’m not, no, maybe I exaggerate.
It's not like I'm waking up thinking “I hate it here, I can't wait to move,” but like, there's never been a time I've not wanted to go back to St. Paul.
SB: Yeah. Well, maybe.
CP: I think it's probably in the cards, stay tuned. We'll see.
SB: Any other personal dish that we need to get into? You wanna transition to some media dish? Or do you wanna stay in the, in the personal dish?
CP: I don't have, I don't know. I have nothing of note for personal stuff. Like, there's stuff happening, but nothing I really wanna share. So–God, that sounds so like secretive. (Saraya laughs) So it's a no from me. Also, like, when have I ever like, not wanted to share? I don't know. It's just like, you know, when you got irons in the fire, or things that you're working through, it's not like time to share yet. Is that the wrong idiom, irons in the fire?
SB: No, no, no. That's right, but also–
CP: –Hands in the pots?
SB: Hands in the pots?!
CP: (Laughs) Isn’t that one?
SB: It might be, it might be.
I'll say about your sharing. So I was like, I saw your cute little six month post with Neno? Girl, too far, too far, my friend.
CP: (Laughs) That's–let's just leave it at that. People can go look, if they want to.
SB: You can go look at Cat's Instagram and you figure out which of those photos–adorable, darling photos–was where Saraya was like,”The line has been drawn and we're well beyond it.” And then comment on that photo and let us know. The interactive component. That's so funny.
So yes, I hear you not wanting to share, and also it's not in your nature from my knowledge.
CP: I know, I'm just, it's–I don't know. Is it the Lexapro? (Saraya laughs) I'm just feeling more like, “Let me sit with this before I like move on things and tell people about things and do stuff,” you know?
SB: Yeah, that's the tagline for Lexapro. “I don't know.”
*b “Is it the Lexapro?”
CP: I mean, honestly, love Lexapro, who’s to know.
SB: “Maybe it’s Maybelline, maybe it’s an SSRI.”
CP: (Laughs) Yeah. But I think, like usual, we probably got lots of TV and media to talk about, huh?
SB: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
CP: Cool. Let's get into it.
SB: Okay, what are you watching? What are you listening to? What are you reading? What do you wanna talk about?
CP: I feel like you're asking me first ‘cuz you know I just have bullshit and you have all the good stuff.
SB: (Laughs) No, it's not my agenda, but I'll take it.
CP: What am I watching? You all know: it's summertime. I'm watching Big Brother. What else am I watching? The frickin’ Bachelorette. I mean, am I proud? No, but am I wrapped up in them both? Very much so.
Um, and other than that, like I guess I'm watching some things that you're watching Saraya; like Everything's Trash, Phoebe Robinson's new series on Freeform, which we watch on Hulu. And also Only Murders in the Building on Hulu. So I guess those are like, two good things I'm tuned into this summer.
And yeah, I’m continually not watching as much TV, but I know you're watching a lot of TV huh? Or just, I just see a long list of things on here is all I'm saying.
SB: Yeah, but they're all like short things right now, or currently in session, so it’s like–in session, like it’s court–currently in progress and being released, so it doesn't feel like it's a lot.
CP: Got it.
SB: I will say, okay. Only Murders in the Building. Really enjoy it, season two. Why was Amy Schumer in it? That was weird to me.
CP: I mean, I don't want a, I don't wanna watch her ever. I also–to this point in the season two that I've seen so far, which is, I think I've watched like five or six episodes, I don't see the merit. Is it just ‘cuz like, we had Sting in the penthouse season one, we needed some celebrity in the penthouse season two?
SB: I guess. I truly don't know. They do get some big names. They have like Cara Delevingne right now, which I don't know; it's an interesting casting group. I still enjoy it quite a bit, but I will say my one qualm as like, a podcaster: I don't know if you've seen this episode, but they show Cinda Canning at her studio, and that's played by Tina Fey. So she's like the, the Serial podcaster extraordinaire. It's just like a desk and some like dope looking microphones, not–there is no sounding. And maybe it is, maybe we're still so small–
CP: You mean, I'm in this closet for nothing?! I'm roasting in my closet for nothing?!
SB: Roasting? Glowing, dewy.
CP: Thanks for that. No, I–the reason I had–well, no. I got the idea to be in the closet from that book we read, but I remember hearing people from NPR when they talked about transferring to work from home in early panini days, they mentioned recording in their closets.
SB: Yeah. So wasn’t it Sam Sanders. What's his name? Yep. Sam Sanders. When he first went home, he was under his table with like, a sheet over it.
CP: Amazing.
SB: Yeah, it's great. So anyways, that's my umbridge that I have with Only Murders in the Building.
CP: So far, I'm more into season one than two, but I'm still happy to be watching it.
SB: Yeah. It's interesting, it's engaging.
CP: What do you think of Everything's Trash?
SB: I like it! It's like, easy in a way that a quick easy show pre-pandemic was for me to watch, but also Phoebe is–has like, a very specific character that she's portraying with a very like…she's very vocal. She's very insistent on her beliefs. I mean, she's a podcaster too.
What is this with podcasters being the main like TV show people? Is that like when movies had architects or like, wedding planners be the main people? Is that what podcasters are to romantic comedies?
CP: I don’t know, is this like, a sexy profession? Oh my God, there was, that was also a thing in the Sex and the City reboot as well, podcasting!
SB: Did not watch, zero out of ten–
CP: –You’re fine. Unfortunately I did, add it to my list of trash but that was their big theme there. Carrie then was part of a podcast with Che, who was played by Sara Ramirez, what a babe. That was like a whole big thing.
Yeah. Is podcasting the new cool thing for the TV? Are we new and cool, Saraya? Just as we're getting out of it. My gosh.
SB: Ma'am, ma'am. If you have to ask if we're new and cool–
CP: –We're neither new nor cool.
SB: We are hip. We are on the cutting edge. No, no.
Um, let's see, what else, what else is on?
CP: What are you watching? Excuse my yawn.
SB: The Bear! The Bear!
CP: Okay. Everyone–you and Neno are telling me I need to watch The Bear.
SB: I really enjoyed it. I love Ayo Edebiri. I don't know if I pronounced her name correctly, I'm so sorry, I've only seen it written. She's a comedian, I've really liked her stuff. She's not necessarily comedic in this role. She does a great job. There's a dude from Loiter Squad, which maybe means nothing to most people.
CP: Nope.
SB: But he, he plays like–he wants to be a pastry chef basically in it, and he does a really great job. His name is Lionel Boyce, the actor.
Um, it's just–the premise, maybe I should have started with that, that would've been a lot easier–is a restaurant in Chicago that was–
CP: –Chicago! Midwest represent!
SB: Exactly, exactly. It was left to this like, kind of wunderkind chef who's like this prodigy–
CP: –The blonde guy.?
SB: Mhmm, the blonde guy that everybody's showing the photo of, yup. Uh, his brother used to run it. It was his parents, I think. And now he's left with it, and it's kind of like, all of the characters of the people who make the restaurant successful and run, and how they work together or don't work together, and it’s really, really engaging. And I've heard from a lot of folks who have worked in the service industry that it does a really great job of capturing the chaos and dysfunction and familial relationships of working in a restaurant, so.
CP: Cool.
SB: Yeah, I love it.
CP: I'll have to–I'll have to watch it at some point.
SB: That’s a no, that means no, that means you'll never watch it.
CP: No, not never. But it's not high on the list.
SB: That's fine, that's fine. You know what, what should be high on the list?
CP: What?
SB: Okay. I don't know how I found this, but I was on YouTube yesterday.
CP: You watch YouTube like that?
SB: No, I don't.
CP: Oh, okay.
SB: No, I wasn't on YouTube. I was on Instagram and there was a reel, I was like, “What am I watching? I don't understand.” It was for a YouTube show called Cut. And I don't even think it's necessarily new, but it's like a speed dating show. And the premise is that you have two people sit across from each other, and then there's this little button in the middle of the table that asks them questions, and then it turns red. And if it turns red, one of the two can eliminate the other person.
CP: Does it feel a little bit like MTV's Next from 20 years ago?
SB: Kind of, but like, now and updated. That's exactly the thought I had. And the premise is that if you end up talking to each other for 10 minutes, like, your second date is all expenses paid.
CP: Oh, what a, what a premise!
SB: What a premise! It is like a car crash, and also like, you're hoping for the best, and also disappointed when people are really callous or just like really quick to dismiss people, so.
CP: Well, and this is me feeling like you with this comment, but like, it's TV. So I'm sure they're purposely pairing people they know aren't gonna go well together for like, the clicks and the drama that will happen, you know?
SB: Maybe. It feels really low budget, so I don't, I don't know. I think they just had people, got them to come in early in the morning and just try out this weird thing.
CP: Interesting.
SB: It is. It sucks, though, when there'll be like, a fat person immediately gets discarded; or like, a non-white person. Like, it's just weird how that works out. No, it's not.
CP: I mean, it it's predictable, but it's like, it's still–it's like, hard to watch, I'm sure.
SB: Yeah, but also engaging, ‘cuz then it's also a game. It's like whoever rejects the other person first then has control of the next engagement.
CP: Oh, interesting.
SB: It's weird. Anyways. They're not very long, it's called Cut. Don't watch it, necessarily, but I found it very intriguing. I thought you would, Cat. It's like, it feels more reality TV-adjacent than anything else.
Um, what else? Miss Marvel, I've been watching Miss Marvel.
CP: Is that a movie or a show?
SB: It's a show on Disney+. I am enjoying it; I definitely have, like, critiques, but as far as Marvel stuff goes, I really really like it. Maybe more than anything else that's out there. So that's what I got.
CP: That's cool.
SB: I don't know. You don't know anything Marvel, so I don't need to go into it anymore.
CP: Wait, was Black Panther Marvel?
SB: Yeah, yeah.
CP: That's–again, and this is–I feel like I said, it's the only Marvel movie I've ever seen, so it was great. Watched it three times, but it's the only one I know. I know nothing.
SB: I think, I mean, I think you would like this, and also I don't think you're a Disney+ member.
CP: No. I think Neno is, I mean, I could access it, but I don't think I care enough to find it. Oh, I'm sorry, that was rude. But I don't think it's, I would sooner watch The Bear than Miss Marvel, I think.
SB: And you would sooner watch The Office before that, so.
CP: Mhmm, well–
SB: –Frasier–no, sorry. Frasier.
CP: Frasier. Absolutely, every night. (Both laugh)
SB: Yeah. Okay, so that's like everything I care to talk about as far as watching, but I will–I don't even wanna talk about what I'm reading, honestly. It's not that good, I don't need to give it space or time.
CP: What am I–also same, but I might have more to report back in a future, a future Fat Dish. I've been really getting into different–I've been trying to find podcasts that I don't hate about business lately. (Saraya laughs) It's rough out there, but it's also hard because, like, some that I find to be pretty off-putting also have some gems and it's like, what's the gem-to-cringe ratio here? And like, what can I be okay with, you know? Oh, it's a whole thing, but that's probably a tale for another day.
SB: Okay. Well, I mean, I don't know. Oh yeah. I guess the one thing is Beyonce's album is coming out, so–
CP: –Ah, yeah.
SB: We haven't heard it yet. I think we will have heard it once this comes out.
CP: Do we know, is it–do we know the date that it's coming out?
SB: Yeah, soon. Let's do some real-time Googling.
It's called Renaissance, and–oh! Oh, it leaked. Today, I guess. So yeah, we'll have heard it for sure. So it's supposed to be tonight, when we're recording, but apparently it leaked. So yeah, we'll have to listen to that.
CP: That's what you'll be doing after, after we hang.
SB: That's all I'll be doing. (Cat laughs) Yup, mhmm.
CP: Cool. Well, you know, I think this probably brings us to some true Fat Dish–though, one could argue that everything is fat dish because we are fat people dishing.
But I know there are some fat things that have already started to kind of come out in our conversation that we wanted to, to give a little more, a little more space to.
SB: Okay. I think we need to bring up the swans again.
CP: Yeah.
SB: ‘Cuz you had a great topic and it just blends perfectly.
CP: It really did. So I didn't find the receipts, like, I didn't find the original thing, but many of you who are fat and on TikTok and or Instagram probably saw that, like there was some stuff going around. Just, long story short, like, when folks offer the sentiment, like, “You can do anything!” Like, “Just ‘cuz you're a plus size person, just ‘cuz you're fat, just ‘cuz you're in a larger body, like don't let it stop you! You can do whatever you wanna do!”
And then so like, folks offering that sentiment and then other folks offering a rebuttal to that, which is like, “Thank you. But also like, no.”
Like there are things like there are, um, because of anti-fat bias in the design and structure of our community–in terms of like, physical things and also ideologies–you know, there are very many things that as a fat person, like, we cannot do. And you can't just like, positive-think your way out of it, you know?
SB: Bootstraps it, baby.
CP: Yeah. And an example of that is me and Neno on the swans. (Laughs) Like, no amount of self love is gonna help us make that work for us, you know?
And I do, I will say–and I guess like, this is, I don't, I understand what those folks with the initial sentiment were trying to do. And I do think that like, I would encourage people to live your life now; like, you know, like, try to pursue the things that will bring you joy and adventure in your life, whatever size you are.
But you can't be polyannaish about it and like, not recognize that there are things that you just like, you know, as a fat person, you will not be able to do because of your weight, because of how things are set up in our culture.
SB: Yeah. I think you had talked about this previously when we've been discussing, but it's like body positivity versus fat liberation.
CP: Right, right, right, right. Yes. That's how I see it too, yeah.
SB: Well, I think okay. To that end, another kind of icky thing happened that is just a good example of the difficulties of being fat in the world, and how it's–even when awful things happen, sometimes it's compounded by inaccessibility to certain necessary items. And I'm really just teasing it now, maybe I should just let you tell the story.
CP: No, well, something happened recently, um, where my boyfriend got something stolen from their car, and some of that included a suitcase with luggage in it from a trip they had just taken. And so a bunch of their clothes were stolen. And I don't know if you remember–I don't know if I, I mean you do, Saraya, ‘cuz that's all I ever talked about for, for forever. I don't know if I talked about it a lot on the podcast, but three times over the past year–I guess it was all during pandemic life–I had my laundry stolen. Like my clean laundry that I–for a little while I was a little bit of a bougie bitch and I had my laundry sent out, it was the most incredible thing ever, and my laundry was stolen three times, and so then I had to quit the service.
I was like, “Okay, you know, three strikes you're out.” And it was not the service that messed up, it was just like, my building was not–is not super secure. So that happening to them really brought me back to those laundry moments. ‘Cuz I just, like 100% understand what that feels like, and it's just so hard. Like, I think some people think like, “Oh yeah, I just like go buy more underwear. Like just like go buy more jeans, like, go buy more stuff,” like whatever.
But when you are a fat person who wears plus sizes and like, have worked so hard to curate your closet and can't just walk into a Target and get everything you need, but need to like order things and have things that, oh, that doesn't exist anymore. How will I find that? It's really hard.
And I think like the one, the like, sort of blaring signal that this says to me here is like, the fat tax; how fat people often have to pay more for things. And I would like to submit that like, like our time and energy is also at more of a premium in these scenarios. And I would put that under this like, fat tax umbrella as well.
SB: Absolutely. Yeah. Icky, icky icky.
CP: I know, yeah.
SB: My question, I think I brought this up, but like, I would be so livid if somebody tried to sell back your clothes to you.
CP: That is, I mean, that's the thing, right? I just it's, that's the worst part of it. I don't think that any criminal is like, actually gonna do that; like to go to like, take these things to Cake Plus Size Resale and try to like, sell them to my shop.
I mean, what adds sort of insult to injury is like, I'm sure these things just got like disposed of and a dumpster somewhere, you know? Like, I really don't think that those garments are being worn or–and, you know, for sure not treasured. And so that's what makes it really hard too. Like, you can't even get much money for these things. Just like, give it back to me, you know?
SB: Yeah. It's also like such. I don't know. You're you've gotta be in a certain state or frame of mind to steal like, laundry.
CP: Oh, absolutely. I mean, I think any kind of thievery, there's a reason why people steal stuff is ‘cuz they are not doing well, you know.
Our culture is not–like, our society has not, is not supporting people in the ways they need. And it's like, it's so hard to know that and then have your shit taken and be like, “Oh, I know that. But man, this sucks,” you know?
SB: Right, yeah. Yes, totally.
CP: It's so hard. Well, I think that there's like more fat stuff that has come up a little bit in some things that are going on in your world, right?
SB: A little bit, yeah. So as I'm considering the move to an apartment it’s you know–I've been in my building for about two years and it's, it's like pretty decently comfortable. Like my exact apartment is, I enjoy it. But now I'm thinking about, “Okay, do I wanna live in a duplex? Do I wanna live in a newer building?” Like, what are, what's the cost of doing that obviously, but also like, what are accessibility aspects? Or comfort aspects? Like, what will be the size of hallways or the size of stairwells? Um, not that I think about that on a regular basis, but I think it's worthwhile, like, to consider. What does that mean in winter? What does that mean, you know, going out at night or not?
CP: Yeah. You know what's on my list with that, Saraya, which I've what–it's kind of silly, but very real? How much room do I have to like, move my legs around when I'm on the toilet? Because like, I–this is cutting it, maybe oversharing information.
SB: Oh wow, yeah, I feel it in my bones, I do.
CP: I've learned that, like, I think I spread my legs wider than most people do when I'm wiping and–
SB: –Oh my God–
CP: –And I notice that I bump into stuff sometimes. Like, as I'm like using, well, let’s be frank here, in Neno's bathroom more than my bathroom. I'm like, “Ugh, I don't have as much spread room here,” you know? And it's like, I, those are things that I need to think about when I'm like gonna be in a space, using that bathroom primarily.
SB: Yeah, no, that's fair. And especially as I'm looking at these like, cute duplexes that are old and have amazing, like built-ins, it's like, yeah, the bathrooms were nothing. The kitchens were nothing. Like, another thing I consider is like floors. Like how, how noisy or creaky is it gonna be? Especially if I'm an upstairs neighbor. Or like, will I feel stable like running around or, I don't know. Just all of that.
And also another one is temperature control.
CP: Oh, absolutely.
SB: I've gotten really accustomed to a certain lifestyle where I can control my temperature at the touch of a button. It is like, such a luxury. ‘Cuz I had radiator heat forever and ever, and then like a unit for air conditioning.
And so yeah. I'm like, well, I love it. And also is it affordable? Is it doable with some of the other things that I need? And so there's just a lot of considerations. And my needs, these aren't even like, hardcore accessibility needs, but it's just thinking about all the other things that come into mind when people are trying to find a comfortable, safe place to live that's cost effective. It's just, I don't know how it's possible.
CP: Let alone trying to find a bathtub you fit in comfortably, you know?
SB: Yeah. Or something that actually doesn't have stairs if you don't need stairs, or, I don't know. Even my building, I don't think is accessible right now. I look at some things and like, make it make sense. This doesn't work. So like, think about like an older home. It's not gonna be set up for that either.
CP: Yeah. It's just like, I don't know. I'm also, as we record this, I'm just coming off of a fat chat that we–um, for cake, we do monthly fat chats. They're Zoom, um, sort of community conversation events, and the theme for the one tonight was about fat travel. And we really had a lot of conversation around just like, gosh, like these, you know: airplanes, hotels, Airbnb beds. Like people are not offering these, um, these things thinking about larger body folks in mind, like universal design is just so far off of the radar of people.
And yeah, I just, I think that some of that feels like it's relevant to this conversation; with the swans or with the thing you thinking about apartments, Like knowing that like, you know, your body size was not the one that was in mind when someone created this space. And so like, will it work for you? Or might it not?
SB: Mm-hmm. Or, another piece: So I'm going to all these showings and I'm like, how are the people who are renting this looking at me? I know that they have to look at all these other considerations, but like, will my body size, will my skin color, will my name cause them to decide not to rent it to me when things are going so quickly.
CP: This is a little bit of another little bummer Fat Dish. Not bummer, but it's like the harsh realities of the world around us.
SB: Yeah. I will say I'm really going into with a mindset of like, I'm looking forward to loving where I live, and there are many other places to live in my future, and you know, I'm gonna figure it out. Just takes a little bit of work to get there, so.
CP: And I think maybe–not maybe, definitely–more work for fat folks, and also I believe there is a place out there for you and you're gonna find a really lovely place to move.
SB: Oh, thank you. Yeah, ‘cuz you're gonna come over for brunches.
CP: Oh, anytime you'll have me.
SB: Another thing I gotta think about, do I have space for brunch?
CP: Please! \
SB: The most important question.
CP: Well, I think the last Fat Dish-y thing we should talk about is maybe ending on a silly note, which is referencing another fat podcast in the world, huh?
SB: Yeah. I love that you heard this–like I added this to our outline and you were like, “Yeah, let's talk about it.”
So the most recent Maintenance Phase episode that we listen to upon recording this, they have this little moment where they accidentally say something at the same time and they say, “Oh, let's do this in unison, like some bad eighties sitcom.” And I immediately thought, Cat and I–
CP: –Is that us? All our “Matter of Fat”s in unison? (Saraya laughs) Are we a bad eighties sitcom?
SB: I mean, there's plenty of puns.
CP: Well, there really are.
SB: There really are. We're harkening back to the old days. But yeah, I just thought that was so funny that they called that out. They're like, ‘Oh, that'd be so cheesy.”
And it's like, yeah, well, yep. Got that covered, please don't take that from us.
CP: Yeah. Oh man. (Laughs)
SB: Yeah. So, okay. Let's, let's–I mean, if you're an avid listener, you'll know that we've covered our main three segments for a Fat Dish episode, but wait, there's more. We are so pleased in this final season to be able to share, you know, periodic guest update!
So today we are giving you a little sneak peek–I don't know why it's a sneak peek, it’s not even a sneak peek. We're gonna take a moment to like, hear from–well, here by way of Cat–but from Ani, from our season three interview, and she is fabulous.
If you need a quick refresher, when we talked to her, we talked about the Rad Health Alliance, her work with ASDAH and I mean the pandemic, enjoying the seasons as they passed.
CP: The seasons, mhmm!
SB: So we had a really wonderful conversation with Ani and yeah. Cat, what is Ani's update?
CP: Yeah, she sent a great update. And so y'all, these are Ani Janzen's words. She says:
“It's hard to believe nearly two years have passed since I was on Matter of Fat and grappling with the beginnings of a global pandemic and the uprisings in response to George Floyd's murder. I'm sure others too, feel the heaviness of the past two years and figuring out how to hold on to hope and joy where we can.
My work has adjusted to being a hundred percent remote, holding virtual yoga classes, trainings and workshops. My work at Radical Health Alliance is much more focused on getting in front of health professionals to talk about weight bias and the science of weight and health, which is really exciting.
In the last year. I've given over a dozen presentations to 350 current and future healthcare professionals. I'm also serving on a couple advisory boards, including one with Health Partners. We're also working on a public listing of local health professionals who practice in less harmful ways for fat. My role with ASDAH–like the, spelled A-S-D-A-H, and which stands for the Association for Size Diversity and Health, the org that holds the health at every size trademark–has grown, and I'm now the operations and project leader on a phenomenal team deeply committed to intersectional liberation.
We just held our first conference in four years with some of the most exceptional voices transforming fat liberation, like Da’Shaun Harrison and Dr. Joy Cox. I'm so excited to continue my work with both organizations making change to healthcare systems here in Minnesota and globally. Sending all the fat love and solidarity to you, Cat and Saraya, and your listeners.”
Oh, thank you, Ani, for that awesome update!
SB: Such a good update. She's like a powerhouse, I'm so impressed.
CP: Seriously. Oh. And I'm just like, Ani's doing such great work, and also just like, miss that girl! I need to, I need to get, get a Zoom hang on the books with her.
SB: Get a Zoom, book a zoom, baby.
CP: I love a little Zoom hang still these days. ‘Cuz I think Ani's still doing most stuff virtual and I would be happy to, yeah, to hang out with her that way.
We will, of course, link to Rad Health Alliance and ASDAH in our shownotes so ou can check out that information again, related to Ani's work. And yeah, love the update and you all can look forward to more updates from previous guests as our season continues.
[TRANSITION MUSIC FADES IN, FADES OUT]
SB: I am glowing from this episode. Even though it was structured, planned, and executed in an amount of time, I am loving it.
CP: (Laughs) I am also glowing and a little sweaty in my closet. (Both laugh) But it's a glow!
SB: It's a glow. It's not a, it's a sheen of glow.
CP: It’s a shine. I'm glistening.
SB: Glistening. Dewy. Yeah.
Okay, y'all so if you want–and I would encourage you to do so–visit our website, www.matteroffatpod.com, to find shownotes, transcripts, info about Matter of Fat, access to older episodes or a link to our Fat Cash via Venmo.
CP: Yes! Check out our website and we would love it if you would send us some Matter of Fat love in the form of Fat Cash on Venmo, here in our fifth and final season.
SB: Yes, and we can shout you out in our next episode.
CP: We'd love to do that. And same if you give us a little review in Apple Podcasts. We appreciate you all and hope that you'll subscribe, rate, review, whatever you can do or is possible on whatever platform you're listening to Matter of Fat.
SB: Yeah. Until next time when we're back with another episode of–
Both: –Matter of Fat.
SB: So cheesy.
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